0:02 Who are you [music] and where are you going? What do you want? [music] [music] Hello and welcome to People Making Money. I'm your host, Kevin Beml, and I'm here every Wednesday at 10:00 a.m. Pacific time to talk about job hunting, starting and running a business, and building wealth. So, the whole financial side of our lives. And today, I'm actually going to be talking about an
0:37 aspect of job hunting. I realized I I haven't talked about that uh o um very much over the last year or so. And going forward, I'm going to be looking to address it on a much more periodic basis. Um, I think it's it's a timely topic and an important one. And, um, like I said, I I I haven't been giving it enough attention. So, uh, today I'm going to be talking about, um, what I'm calling the the hidden job market. It's
1:12 actually I I could have called it the real job market. Uh and and that's because um while it seems like um all job hunting is online these these days and has been for quite some time, the reality is that um not a lot of jobs are actually filled through the online job market. uh they're they're actually filled offline and the online process is just used to do the paperwork. But the the
1:49 the fact of the matter is that es especially the higher you go in terms of compensation for a job, the less likely it is that the candidate who actually gets that job applied through some sort of uh site like Indeed or um glass door or whatever. Uh and so that begs the question then well how do how does one get these uh good paying jobs these highpaying jobs so I'm not talking by
2:24 the way about seuite level jobs u the fact of the matter is that's that's a completely different world in terms of job hunting uh and and that none of that happens online I'm not even sure that you know someone who is uh you know being recruited to be the president or senior vice president or for that matter even the vice president of a company uh it's it's unlikely they're even processing their paperwork online although somebody may be doing
2:59 that for them. So but I'm I'm talking about more of the the midlevel to upper midlevel jobs. So ones that pay in the very high five to the low uh six figure salaries um and and uh you know th So those are the types of jobs that I'm going to be um talking about um and and I've got um I think six ideas to share with you on this. Yeah, six ideas to share with you on this. So let's let's get right into it. So um
3:36 first of all I want to talk first of all um a lot of the best jobs don't ever get posted on job boards whether they're you know the like I said the the Indeeds and glass doors of the world or whether it's the company a company has its own uh online job board a lot of these jobs are never posted and and the the the reality is that uh for um senior and high impact roles. Um the company fills these through trusted referrals or quiet outreach long
4:13 before HR ever does or even has an opportunity to draft a post that would go online. And and when you think about it, it makes sense. So, if if we're talking about uh maybe like an assistant vice president position or a director position or some something of that nature, right? One of the things the company wants to know is will this person fit into our culture, right? Are they going to be effective in
4:48 this kind of leadership role in a way that fits with how the company in general handles how the company in general is led? And the best way to know that is getting a referral some from someone who's already in a similar position. um because then that that person is likely to be similar to them. Okay? And that that is, you know, far and away the the the most common way that these jobs
5:25 these types of jobs are filled. So another reason um that the best jobs are never posted is there's a cost and a risk to how it appears when these kind of jobs are posted online. [snorts] So uh some companies will look at it is if if we post a you know a more senior position online so it looks like there's some instability in the company number one. Number two, the person whose whose job is being uh replaced may not know
6:01 that they're going to be replaced and the company may not want to disclose that publicly. They want to get someone in place or someone who's going to replace the person first and then let the person know that that they're being fired. It also [clears throat and cough] if such jobs are posted online online so it can create kind of internal political pressure which the company may not want to deal with and as well once a job is posted online it oftentimes will attract
6:39 hundreds sometimes even thousands of applicants and [clears throat] even if a even if a company which most do is using some kind of uh a sort of AIdriven sorting function [snorts] um to sort through hundreds or thousands of applications is is a huge waste of time. Okay. So at at with these kinds of jobs, these quality of jobs, the company has a pretty clear idea of of the type of candidate they want and they don't need, you know, hundreds or thousands of people spamming them with applications
7:15 um when those people are are actually not qualified. And the reality is that is what a lot of job hunters do. So [clears throat and cough] I I know of people who have bragged posting as many as a hundred applications a day. Okay, that's 700 a week, right? Close to what? 3,000 a month. That's just by any standard ridiculous. both from the standpoint of the person who's doing all that posting and for the
7:52 companies who have to sift through that. This is not someone who is being judicious about selecting the jobs for which he believes he's qualified. Okay, [clears throat] pardon me. So um um the other another reason why jobs are not posted online is that uh companies often kind of keep in their back pocket a short list of people that they they
8:31 know about they'd like to recruit or like to bring into the company if a position opens of this type. And so because of that when a position is opening up you know immediately that group of people is going to be contacted they'll probably be substantial discussions with them if any of them are available and one of them will be selected and so there is no again there's no reason to post that job online and then finally uh the the company may may want
9:07 confidentiality ity. So, they may not want to do uh an open online uh uh posting of a job because they don't want to tip off competitors that this person is leaving or that this person is being fired. They don't want to let employees know that there's going to be some turnover. They may not want to let investors know until the decisions are finalized. all of all of these people. For example, maybe the person who's who's being fired is very popular with employees, but maybe the reason the
9:42 person is popular with employees is because they're not being diligent in seeing that work gets done. Well, so to let employees know that this person is is being fired invites a backlash from employees at a time when there's no one to take over that role and and set the ship of rights as we say. So, and the same thing can be true of investors. Investors may view a person as being um crucial to the success of a company whereas management
10:19 may not see the person the same way and they don't want to risk the misperception of investors um by you know prematurely announcing that this role is is you know that this role is open and and they're they're looking to bring someone new in. They would rather be able to announce that, you know, John Smith is t is is assuming the role of, you know, vice president of customer relations or uh director of customer relations or something like that. Um
10:56 be and and that way and and then they can they can craft the message about why this new person is being being brought in in such a way that investors will be reassured that this will improve the operation of the company. Okay. So for for all of those reasons uh oftentimes the best jobs are just they're not posted. Um, and and by the way, if they end up being posted at some point, it's it's typically because it's a problematic position. Um, there's
11:33 probably been a lot of turnover in it and so any, you know, the company has already worked through their favored candidates and and now they just can't find anybody good to handle the position. And that's a clue to job hunters that maybe the position is not as great as it would appear to be by its title or by its job description. Okay. So next um there are groups of there are a group of people that in in general kind of control the
12:08 hidden job market. Okay. and and these are recruiters and head hunters um and and firms that that handle these. And so um these these types of firms or or you know recruiters. So they what they do is they specialize in knowing qualified people typically in particular industries and so and they've they've already done a lot of the checking and verifying and
12:43 establishment of credentials. And so for a company that's looking to replace a highlevel person, um it it it makes more sense to go to to a recruiter recruiting firm because the whole process can happen much more quickly. Okay. Now you might say, well, but these firms charge a lot of money. Well, yes, they do. However, the cost of a of a of a you know um upper midlevel to lower senior job
13:19 turning over can be anywhere from 3 to six months of that employees salary. [snorts] And so to pay the recruiter it it's just it it's just part of the cost of dealing with this kind of turnover. And for a for most companies that expense is is not gerine in making a decision about how they're going to find you know the the particular candidate who's going to end up being selected for the job. Okay. So um this this then you know if if there's any you know job
13:55 boards being used um you know the recruiting company might find a candidate there but then they're going to vet that candidate. They're not pulling that candidate raw from a job board. Okay. And by by the way, one of the reasons to selectively post on, you know, for jobs on job boards is not necessarily to get the jobs that for which you're applying. It's to put yourself in front of recruiting firms in that particular industry who then might pick you up as a
14:33 potential recruit and help you sidestep the whole job board online job hunting uh process. Okay. So um the the other another aspect of of you know who controls the hidden job market is there are internal decision makers who often have at least informal succession plans. Okay. And and so when someone at an upper midlevel or or lower senior level
15:08 uh position is is being replaced or is being sought. So these sort of informal uh succession plans are examined and the internal decision makers um will often times they'll get together and they'll they'll have conversations about the kind of person for whom they're looking. Maybe even they have some ideas that that perhaps they're not sort of a short list but but they will in the moment create a short list of candidates um from this you know from this group of
15:44 internal decision makers and then they'll just go out to those people rather than posting and going through the whole online job situation. Okay. Um, another source a of of not not so much control per se, but another reason why the hidden job market stays hidden is because um often times these candidates are put forward by members of the board or investors or other trusted advisors, lawyers, accountants and and
16:22 you know let's take for example position of of controller, okay? Someone who's going to be overseeing the finances of a company. So, you might have an investor uh or an investment group put forward a candidate uh and the company may want to seriously consider that person solely because they want to retain the good graces of that investor group. On the flip side, the accounting, let's say there's an outside accounting firm that's, you know, doing uh part of the
16:57 accounting work, maybe the tax preparation for the company or maybe they're doing the audit. And so, you know, they will have the greatest insight on the qualifications that the comproller for that company needs. And so, they may recommend people uh to the company that are appropriate for that position. Now, that's going to be subject to them not wanting to create a conflict of interest and such. So, you know, there may be uh you know, some some issues that need to be dealt with in that regard. Uh but but nonetheless,
17:32 um you know, these these groups, board members, investors, trusted advisors, oftent times they will be the sources for these types of candidates for these highquality jobs rather than the human resources department. Okay. And and the other issue is so uh by um recruiting someone or considering people who are being referred in especially if it's by uh sort of insiders in the company or by
18:07 you know again board members, investors etc. the perce the perceived risk of that hire uh seems to be less uh and and and probably is less because unless unless the people are gaslighting is too strong a word but unless they're not being 100% candid about how well they know a particular candidate. So because they they know the person, they may have experience uh um having worked with the person before or
18:43 if it's investors, they may have invested in a in another company where this person they know the performance of this particular candidate. So the the hiring risk probably is less because the person is much more of a known quantity versus someone who was found through uh the online process, job boards, etc. Okay. So um uh in this realm of uh hidden the hidden job market and and and especially the
19:18 hidden job market for uh more senior type roles. So it's really relationships um that matter not not resumeumés. So take an example of um uh the woman who was made editor and chief of CBS news and now I'm Barry Weiss right so uh you know the fact of the matter is and now this is a very senior position obviously uh the fact of the matter is it's it's extremely unlikely that CBS News you know posted that job
19:55 on some kind of job board. Clearly not. What they did almost for sure is convene a group of senior level executives at Paramount and they got together and they said, "Look, who are we looking to take over as the senior editor of CBS News and who do we know? I mean, what what message are we trying to send to our various constituencies? And who do we know who fits that bill?" And I would say it's it's virtually a 100% sure
20:30 thing that someone in that group knew Barry Weiss. they knew the work she was doing at um uh her company, the uh independent um shoot, I'm going up the name of Barry Weiss's company, but you know, at her company and and and and they reached out to her directly and said, you know, [snorts] um Miss Weiss, they probably called her Barry. I I I've I've seen her speak, but I've never met her directly. So, but they would have said, you know, Barry, we'd like to talk to you about taking on the
21:06 uh you know, uh senior editor's job at CBS News, right? Um that's how those things work. Those relationships predated CBS News looking to fill that role with a new candidate. Okay. So I I doubt that you know Barry Weiss even had um even had to send a resume. By the way, her organization is called the free press, not the independent press, the free press. So um at at you know at these oftentimes at these level of jobs, the
21:42 resume just doesn't mean anything. And by the way, it's it's typically assumed that résumés are not uh genuinely reflective of a candidate, right? And that's another reason why the more senior one goes in terms of a job level, the more important a relationship is because when there's a relationship, people know what the candidate has done. they're not relying on a resume to understand the person's background.
22:18 Okay. So this is why it is absolutely crucial to build uh um relationships in your industry in your field because if you want to advance so it's going to happen through people knowing you, knowing your background, having experience dealing with you, having those established relationships. Now there is a big difference between networking and relationship building and I think this this this is perhaps one of
22:55 the uh common misconceptions. So networking is kind of a more transactional type of uh phenomenon if you will. So, you know, you go to a networking meeting, you're looking for leads for business, somebody else is looking for leads for business, you you exchange this, that, and and and that's really all that it's about. Relationship building is about building uh reciprocal knowledge and trust with another person
23:31 without there being any immediate need or any immediate transaction or ask taking place. [snorts] Okay. And and this is why when I when I talk about this aspect I emphasize relationship building. We should always be building relationships. Okay. I've been my professional life now um has been let's see it's been going on for over 40 years. Okay. And two including up to this moment and beyond. Uh I work on
24:08 relationship building. That's one of the reasons why I do these shows because they give me an opportunity to build relationships, to bring guests on and talk to people, get to know them, get to know their background. And there is almost never a a transaction being contemplated. Quite to the contrary, I do it because I want to get to know people. I want to know quality people, quality professionals so that if at some point in the future I need a particular type of professional, I know someone
24:43 already, I know their background, we have an established relationship and so we can handle the matter much more smoothly than it then would be the case if I have to go to the phone book and I know there's not phone books anymore, but you know, metaphorically go to the phone book and find somebody new. Okay. Uh and and so um the other thing that having a an existing relationship does is it keeps you top of mind. So, when a role opens up, and often times
25:19 it's rather sudden that one of these roles will open up, somebody's leaving because they're they're having a a family problem or crisis or there's been a major sh, you know, a major shakeup is announced at the firm and so a lot of people uh decide they're going they're going elsewhere um probably, you know, to avoid getting fired, those kind of things. So uh what what relationships do is they keep us top of mind and then when people when the sudden uh you know shift comes or
25:56 the sudden opportunity comes so um decision makers already know about us they already trust us and so it's natural to give us a call and say hey you know we've got a we've got a position opening up here um would you be interested Right. Uh, and [clears throat] by the way, I'm I'm talking in the context of of job hunting, but just as a quick aside, for those of us who are professionals, um, the process is is fairly similar. It's just we're not being hired as an employee, we're being hired as, you
26:31 know, as a professional, as a consultant or whatever. But it's it's very when it comes to relationship building, it's it's really the same phenomenon. Okay. uh and and as well when we have an existing relationship. So if we're if we then have an opportunity to u to apply for a job or not even apply per se but be considered for a job is a better way of putting it. So the conversations are going to be much warmer than if we're coming in cold, right? And so um uh negotiations
27:07 will start from a pos a position of value rather than justification. So the the company or the person with whom we're discussing an employment arrangement, they they know us or they know there's someone in the organization who knows us and so we're not having to prove our bonafides. we're starting from a much stronger position. Okay, which is always good. And that typically means that uh the negotiations number one will go more smoothly and number two will be much
27:42 more balanced than they would be if if you know we're coming in based on a job board. Okay, let's take a quick break. Come up come back and talk about three more. When life brings unexpected changes, managing inherited property shouldn't add to your stress. Magnum Properties specializes in probate and trust real estate management. We handle the complexities while you focus on what matters most. From property maintenance to tenant relations, from legal compliance to maximizing value, we're
28:18 your trusted partner through every step. Magnum Properties, Inc. turning property challenges into peace of mind. Call us today at 213-264-4396 or visit magnumprops.com. Okay. So, next on the hidden job market. So, we [clears throat] need to position ourselves so that we find opportunities or I'm sorry, so that opportunities find us. Okay. That's that's the key. Okay.
28:55 If we're having to reach out, by definition, we're we're in a weaker position. Whereas, if we're a known quantity in our industry, if we have established relationships and people are reaching out to us, that's a much better situation. Okay. So part of that is building a reputation within our industry. And so uh that means potentially doing things like writing
29:30 art relevant articles online uh being at meetings of professional organizations or trade organizations that are important to our industry. It means mentoring more junior people. Okay? Because if we're the mentor of a more junior person, they'll talk about that and that we're mentoring someone else raises our status. Okay. Um but we also may want to be mentored by a very senior
30:08 person in our industry as well. Okay. that also builds our reputation by showing that we want to learn, we want to grow, etc. Okay, so um when I mentioned writing articles, so that's part of being and I'm I'm not a big fan of this term. Um but it it it is it is the term that's used these days, thought leadership. Uh uh okay, whatever it it implies that somehow um you know whatever you're saying has to be something new per se.
30:45 Um I don't I don't think that's necessarily the case. In some cases emphasizing emphasizing tried and trueue principles is as important if not more so than coming up with some new idea. Okay. So, you know, often times being a leader is reminding people of first principles. Okay. Uh and so by doing but but in any event, by doing the things that so-called thought leaders do, we make
31:22 ourselves vi visible and we start to create again not one of my favorite terms, a sort of personal brand. what we do. Well, I think the best way to think about this is we want to we want to serve our industry in a way that shows that we understand the industry, are a leader in the industry, and want to help the industry prosper. Okay, those are the three things we understand. We're a leader. We want to
31:59 help our industry prosper. So if you're working on doing that then uh you know you are going you are positioning yourself so that opportunities find you. So think about what are the problems facing your industry. Okay. And and what are the solutions to those problems? That's a forwardlooking view. Okay. And and that's oftentimes what people want to know about. So even if other people in your industry don't agree with your
32:35 perspective, it will be very useful for them to read it because it will help them clarify their own thinking. Okay? So if there's if there are conferences conferences and you can speak on a panel about a topic that's important to your industry, you should do that. Look for those opportunities. You may choose even to write a book um or or you know something longer than an article. Okay? You may look to give talks if if that's something that's done within your industry. Now, if you're someone like if
33:11 you're a professional like a lawyer, an accountant, right? So, there are bar associations, there are accounting associations, and oftentimes they do meetings and they have people come and speak. Again, all of that are all of those are opportunities for you to increase your visibility so that opportunities find you. Okay. All right. [snorts] Um so as you increase your visibility um I if you're open to finding a new
33:46 position. So, um, you want to signal doing that without actually, you know, job hunting, right? And so, you know, talk about things like professional growth and and the value of opportunities for professional growth. Talk about how people can advance within your industry. So by covering those kinds of topics they they give a subtle signal that well if somebody's talking
34:22 about advancing in in our business or if someone's talking about how people can uh you know improve their professional prospects etc. So maybe they're interested in doing the same thing for themselves. Okay. So rather than you know um putting on your uh your LinkedIn profile you know open for work or something like that right by the kinds of things that you do to pres present your to to raise your profile you you will be presenting a subtle message that
34:57 you're you're open to an inquiry. Okay. And then finally uh you know look if you are actively looking for a position. So one of the things you can do is when you're having a conversation with one of your uh one of your you know people that with whom you have a relationship. So, you know, look to um sort of move the conversation into a direction where um the the um
35:36 the possibility of you taking a role at their company may come up organically. So, uh you know, you rather than saying, "Do you have any jobs open?" You know, you might you might talk What are you you know how is your company handling growth in the you know marketing in in in the in its marketing department in the marketing area what what are your plans for for you know the coming year or what or do you have a longer term plan right so by talking to people uh you know in
36:13 that context again you're you you might have an opportunity to find out that there is a role open there uh that would be uh good for you or or ideal for you without actually having to go through the formality of of applying. Okay. All right. Um so some common mistakes that keep um you know people who otherwise you know would would be getting high paying jobs stuck on job boards as opposed to working within the hidden job market. So, um, one is just relying on
36:54 online applications, um, to, you know, to find a a a job. It's it's it's it's frankly foolish. Okay. The the I I I once did some research on this. This is now going back uh gosh um let's say I wrote my book in 2017. I'm I mean TW um yeah 2017 is that right? Yeah 2017 so eight years ago over eight years ago. Nine years ago now. And the odds of getting a job through a job board,
37:32 through an through the online application process, are roughly the same as going to Las Vegas, putting your chips on a single number for a roulette wheel and and then the letting the the uh the crewier spin the wheel. It's very very small. Okay. So, but people get hooked into it because it gives them the sense that they're job hunting even though what they're doing is essentially ineffective. Okay? So, rather than engage in ineffective job
38:09 hunting, engage in effective job hunting by starting now to build relationships. The best time to start building relationships two to five years ago. The next best time is now. Okay. Now, if you're job hunting now, admittedly, that's a difficult situation, but you'll still be better um not not spending your time applying online, but looking to build relationships, reaching out to people in
38:46 your field, finding out what's going on, and looking for the hidden opportunities. that's going to be a more fruitful job hunt for you than applying through on through the online systems. Okay. Um and another reason another common mistake um that um people looking for high high paying jobs make is they treat their job search as trans as being transactional instead of a long-term campaign. So the reality is
39:21 we should always be job hunting in essence. Okay? Now for those of us who are professionals who have our own practices like me, I'm always job hunting because I'm always looking for new clients. But I'm not going to people and saying, "Do you want to be my client?" What I'm doing is I am always building relationships. I am always looking for opportunities to deliver value to people in my industry. Okay? I'm always looking to help other people. Uh if there's something I can do, um even if it's just like a a one-off task
39:57 and and I do it pro bono, that's fine. I'm happy to help people, right? So, uh, I just got a text message this morning from someone with whom I'm I'm building a relationship who wants to get into the professional fiduciary uh, business and he's working on getting his license and and so we keep in periodic touch and and and I've been helping him out. I don't I don't get any compensation for doing that. Not looking to get compensation for doing that. What I'm looking to do
40:32 is is build a relationship with him because what he's going to be doing as a professional fiduciary is complementaryary to what I do and and vice versa. And so, uh, we're building a relationship now in anticipation that once he gets into the industry actively, we will there will be kind of a payoff for us. But it's a it's it's a long-term campaign, not a transactional situation. Okay? And that that that should be uh that should be how we view
41:07 any a a a job hunt where you know we're not a professional but we're an employee. It's still the same thing, right? So, just because you just got a brand new job, let's say you got a brand new job as a director, are you saying that if three months later someone called you about becoming an assistant vice president or vice president, you're going to go, "No, I'm not looking for a job right now." I hope, of course, I hope the answer would be, "Well, I'm happy to discuss it with you." Right? Because that's how one advances one's career. Okay. Um,
41:44 another reason that another common mistake that u people looking for um high-paying jobs make is they talk about their skills rather than the kind of outcomes that they seek to bring about through their work and the value that they look to create for the company for which they work. Okay. [snorts] So companies pay for results, not for you fulfilling a task list.
42:22 That's the bottom line. Okay? Now, getting those results often times means getting through a long list of tasks, some of which are tasks you do every day, right? And through that repetition, you bring about the results. But the company is interested in in results especially from uh an employee who's at a a high mid to low senior level position and of course above that as well. And so those are the kinds of discussions you want to have. And and at
42:58 that level, your discussions of your skills aren't nearly as important, if if they're relevant at all, as are the kind of results that you've um gotten for companies that you've previously worked for or the company for whom you for which you're working for right now. Okay. And then finally, um the the last common mistake I'm going to talk about is that um many candidates they they wait for postings for job postings on
43:33 job boards rather than starting conversations. So part of the hidden job market is we have to be proactive. Okay? We can't just wait for jobs to be posted and then, you know, respond to those posts like one of Pavlov's dogs, okay? We have to go out there, talk to people. Now, it's hard. It's hard work. Finding a job, especially at this level, is a full-time job. Okay? So, if the
44:09 plan is to uh spend an hour or two each day uh submitting applications online, candidly, you're not job searching. Okay? You're going through the motions, but but that's not a serious job hunt. Okay? So a serious job hunter while he may from time to time submit an online application just on the you know one in you know for the just on the 3% chance that somehow he gets through all the automated tracking systems and all of
44:45 that. Uh what he's really doing is he's reaching out to people. He's talking to them. He's going to conferences. He's going to industry meetings. He's continuing to post uh articles or thoughts online. He continues posting comments on other people's uh articles that they've posted and is engaged and is engaged for, you know, just like you would be if you were working at your actual job, six to eight hours a day. Okay? After a day of job hunting, you should be at least as tired as a regular day of
45:21 work. That's the nature of a of a a real job hunt. Okay. So, how do you then access the hidden job market practically and ethically? Well, first of all, look at your existing uh network of contacts and assess who they are, how much influence they have, not how much noise do they make, but how how well can they
45:57 make things happen, how much authority and influence within their organization do they have? Are they a decision maker? Okay. Or are they just kind of a cog in the wheel? Okay. Now, now, by the way, that isn't necessarily determined by the person's job title. So, there are vice presidents at organizations that have no authority at all. They make nothing happen. Okay? Okay. This is this is sort of the classic thing at banks. banks give everybody's an AVP or a vice
46:32 president or whatever and [snorts] the reality is they they have you know little or no authority of their own. Okay. On the other hand, the assistant to the president may have an enormous amount of author of authority because he or she has the president's ear. Okay? And the president has come to rely on that person. Okay? So assess people for the influence they have and then look for ways to help them
47:08 augment their influence. Okay? If you help other people, they will they will be more inclined to help you. Okay? So connect with those people. Talk how can I help you? You know, I'm just reaching out. Hadn't spoken for a while. How can I help you? Okay. I did that the other day with someone I know. Um I know he had had some health problems and I I just reached out to him and I said, "Hey, how are you doing? Um anything I can do to help?" And he came back to me said, "Yeah, I'd like to be a
47:43 guest on your show again." Like, "Oh, okay. Yeah, I'd love to have you as a guest." Right. So, um but but my intent was not to recruit him to be a guest. It was just to see how he was doing after his uh health scare. Right. So, um you know talked to another colleague yesterday um who's whose wife just had a baby um and it was you know not a straightforward birth right and we're talking about this and that and I said hey by the way you know how are your wife and and and new child doing and he told me and I said look just see if if
48:18 there's anything I can do I mean presumably you have all your support systems but if there's something I can do uh you know please don't hesitate to reach out. Even if it's like you just need something transported from point A to point B, I'm happy to do it. I said, you know, I I can imagine that this is, you know, a bit of a challenging time, you know, because of of what's going on for you, right? Um, so these are the kinds of things that we can do. They give us a reason to reach out to people and we should do so. That's what people who have a relationship do for each
48:54 other. Okay. Um, another thing to do is to reconnect with with past colleagues. Okay. So, um, you know, in the same way that I I mentioned, you know, checking in with this, uh, one person I know to see how he was doing health-wise and with this other person, you know, knowing um, like I said, the situation in in his family, those, you know, reach out to past colleagues and and and and offer them, you know, look to be creating value for them. That's really the watch word. Okay. So
49:29 reaching out in a way that um we're saying I want to help you and support you. Okay, that avoids some or all of the awkwardness that other my wise might come up. Especially if you say I'm looking I I know we haven't spoken for two years. I'm looking for a job. Can you help me? Okay, that's that outreach is likely to go, you know, click delete. Okay. So, don't do it right. Treat relationships for as the valuable
50:04 things that they are. Okay. Now, if you can't think of a way to reach out to a person from a value uh you know from a val from a a perspective of value. So, we have a great tool for figuring that out. Now you've got large language models uh prox uh proximity chat GPT quad and say hey I've got a colleague I haven't spoken to in two or three years I'm I'm job hunting but you know I don't want to throw that in his face. um give
50:39 me some ideas on how I can reach out to this person that shows that I I valued our past relationship, would would like to rekindle it and want to add value to their situation and see what see what Claude says, see what you know, chat GPT says. I I I found these you know AI large language models to be very effective not necessarily in finding the solution but in stirring the kind of thinking that leads me to the solution. Okay. So next uh reach out to people and
51:17 invite them for you know to go for a coffee if if they you know if if you know if you live in the same area or maybe even a cocktail and say hey we haven't we haven't seen each other for a while um just thought if you're if you have some time let's get to get maybe we could get together have a cup of coffee or have a drink and just catch up. Okay, another way to, you know, reconnect with people or maybe it's someone that you have um already you've been building a relationship, but maybe you've never met in person. So, maybe reach out to them and say, "Hey, you know, we've never met in person. Um I I'm I know you're busy
51:54 um as we all are, but I thought, you know, we could take 45 minutes and meet for coffee or we could meet for, you know, 45 minutes after work and have a drink." um my you know my generation coffee and drink both works and maybe for younger people meeting for a drink doesn't work. I I don't know you know you you know your own uh age cohort. Okay. Um but um look to have informal conversations preferably face-toface those are more powerful or on the telephone if if if face to face doesn't work maybe you're
52:29 not in the same you know location or whatever um because there's an opportunity for thing things to come up that might not otherwise you know in an email or text messages or whatever okay do a virtual uh meeting um you know I I have been um working with some working with someone on on one of the estates that I'm administrating and um after you know a couple of months of of working with the other you know she reached out to me she says hey would you like to meet I'm like yeah why not you know that that you know we're looking to build a
53:04 relationship a business relationship and so that was fine we ended up doing it virtually and we scheduled it for 45 minutes and ended up talking for over an hour Right. So the meeting went very well. Okay. Finally, and and I' I've already mentioned this, but look to play the long game. So timing, patience, building up the the the the valuable interactions between you and the other person. Okay, these are all this is all
53:39 of the groundwork that you want to lay. Um again, the best time to start it was two or more years ago. The next best time to start it is now. Okay? Because if you want to find if you want to enter into the hidden job market where all the best jobs are, okay, it's not something you're going to be able to do just step in and there you go. It's not going to happen that way. You're going to have to do your homework. You're going to have
54:14 to do the hard work of relationship building and and you know, periodic contacts. You're going to have to do the hard work of building up a reputation. Okay? Now, your reputation only needs to be as strong as where you're at in your career. Okay? But you still need to do that work if you really want to advance and especially if if if you're relatively new to an industry and you really want to reach the upper levels. So then you need to be doing that constantly and constantly building. Okay. So that's how to uh work within
54:52 the hidden job market. It's really the way to find any kind of job that's worth having. So, if you have uh thoughts, comments, criticisms, links to social media will be in the show notes after this episode posts on uh YouTube. Um if you're watching this on uh Spotify or Apple Podcast and and uh you you like the show, uh please leave a comment. Um, that way uh I I you know, maybe someone else will read it and I'll have an opportunity to help out another person and may perhaps even gain them as a
55:28 subscriber. I'd really appreciate that. And so, uh, let's see. Um, just a reminder of my other shows on Monday at 10:00 a.m. Pacific time, Trust and Estates Weekly. Tuesday at 10 a.m. Pacific time, business lessons from the military. Wednesdays like today at 10:00 a.m. Pacific time, people making money. And every other Thursday at 5:00 p p.m. Pacific time, meet me at Jiggers's place. We'll have a cocktail and a smoo and talk about things unrelated to finances. So again, thank you so much
56:03 for joining me today. Wishing you a wonderful rest of the day and signing off as I always do. Marie darling, you are my bell. Courage at all times.