0:00 people making money I'm your host Kevin bemel and we're here every Wednesday morning at 10:00 a.m. Pacific Time 1 1 pm eastern time so it's it's already gosh afternoon on the East Coast um and and for my viewers in Europe and Africa what it must be evening there I think what about nine o'clock that's right my mom's in Germany so six or seven hours ahead now yeah yeah so uh so thank you for joining us and uh today I I'm I'm really really excited to be talking to a
0:37 relatively new friend of mine uh Vanessa Donaldson I I had the um opportunity to be on her show a few weeks ago and she's now returning um the favor by uh you know subjecting herself to to being on people making money um I I think though this is not a perspective that we've we've had on the show we we've had lots of military people um but Vanessa is what what we call um in in the the sort of lingo a mill spouse or was a mill spouse which
1:15 stands for military spouse right the the the military loves you know acronyms like that and um if you saw any of my social media posts so you saw that I I said now she's a Civ spouse yes Ian spouse right um and and so uh you know we're going to talk about or I'm going to um um ask Vanessa to talk about her her life her journey um and and I think we're gonna learn some some very useful lessons from uh what what Vanessa has to tell us so thanks
1:51 for thanks for joining me so much thank you so much k for having me appreciate it yeah so you know I I as I do with um almost all my guests on this show um I'm there's a question I I'm always curious to know and that is you know when when you were a child you know was what you're doing now is that what you you know dreamed about being um or what you know what was your expectations for for adult life especially um adult professional or
2:27 career life you know when you're and going back as far as you care to go you know some people go all the way back to like when they were five or six others start more in high school but you know as far back as you're willing to take us yeah so yeah that's a that's a question that could go on for minutes days hours so we'll try to condense it in this time frame but for me going back when you phrase that question it has to go back to my um Youth and being born really I was born to into parents of diplomats my dad was the state department for Service Officer wow uh working for the US
3:03 government and he came from a poor black Alabama family I mean the one photo I've seen they were like wearing torn pants Barefoot cotton picking type time so he really changed the trajectory of his life trajectory projectory I guess either one yeah and um and so you know I I share that story with my my kids too because that's your past that's your heritage and look what he did he didn't play a victim he did not just think small and say well this is where I'm going to be forever in this poor town of Alabama picking cotton or doing whatever he's got ancestry that go into Native American Cherokee landb so I've got that
3:39 too wow so for him to and end up joining the Army went to Boston College graduated Magna kumla in accounting wow one of the probably I think the first black man that went there one of the few and um ended up in the state department you know served in the Army and then State Department so really changed I give that perspective because I want everybody to know like where you start doesn't mean that's where you end and he just I'm I'm just so grateful that he thought so big in that time frame without social media without internet without all the Google search and how can I change without the life coaching he was just picking himself up by the bootstraps and he ended up meeting my
4:14 mom um who I can interrupt you for just one second if if you know so um when you'll see when I sign off I I sign off to a particular individual and she actually is a a very dear dear friend of mine who lived her whole life in Alabama so Alabama holds a particularly special place in in my heart she's she's not with us anymore unfortunately um but I'm I'm just curious where where in Alabama did your father grow up if if yeah I had to do
4:49 some research and please I talk a mile a minute so feel free to say hold up the finger slow out and stop because I want you to get these questions in and ask ask things that are that you're curious about or I can just be like freight train so I couldn't even pronounce the name for a while I'm like where the heck did my father where was he born and now that we do the van life my husband and I have actually driven through the area and I saw my maiden name gray written gray Chapel gray this gray that so the town is ohashi Alabama I was didn't even know it exist I'm like is that a madeup name I got to go to a map and look but there really is a little town C called ohashi Alabama and where in Alabama is
5:24 that it's dead center I think I don't know I I don't remember we just drove through it on the way to uh Canon Alaska but I really don't know the the pin drop yet it sounds like it could be a Cherokee name I mean the the CH Nation you know populated most of the southeast at one time so exactly and my root he held up a map once of these Native American tribes and said this is us this is where Cherokee just so you know and then he passed away of a heart attack when I was in college so all these questions I have remaining lingering I wanted to ask can't get them so I've done a little research on my own but ohchi Alabama
6:01 Cherokee yeah so from all that now Flash Forward into the 60s he's overseas and he meets my blue hair blue haired no now they have blue hair blueeyed blonde haired mom from Berlin Germany so she grew up child of war in Nazi Germany with um bomb bomb shelters going off she was running down the basement living on potato pancakes in a basement um on and off I mean that was a staple Tradition at our house too potato pancakes she just never left her so when um she left the nest I think in her late 20s she wanted she only spoke German and wanted to go to um England
6:38 somewhere to learn to learn English so a lot of people left Germany and they went to London they they took any job they could to start learning English but yeah so she ended up learning English got got a job as a nanny and still keeps in touch I think the parents have died off and the guys are like all in their 50s and up and she still travels around to San Francisco to wherever they are and reconnects it's amazing she raised these four kids so that was great training parenting training for her so they met long story short no it's never short but that whole iconomy culture of a black American meeting a German woman in Progressive Europe they were going to
7:13 speak easy clubs hearing jazz music and you know she brought him home to my family my mom's family in Berlin and said this is the guy I'm gonna marry and they kind of looked crosseyed like what is this like they've only seen Africans in Africa wearing tribal stuff with you know bones and ears like a whole different thing and she's like no this is the guy I fell in love with so that's kind of the mindset that I got brought into they were very forward thinking very Progressive very like out of the box so yeah that's what they created and and um their first assignment was in Cameroon West Africa so that's where I was actually born with a US passport and
7:50 again there most of those diplomatic wives got on the next plane to Paris to give birth in Paris in like a really functioning you know operational hospital but my mom's like why would I get on a plane and fly here the president's daughter just opened a hospital and I'm going to be the first patient so we were like the little trial think she showed a stayed in Africa she's like you're not going to Paris would have been nice to have Paris on my passport but no it shows Cameroon it's a little harder for TSA but um but yeah so that's what I was born into we did lived in Cameroon Vienna Austria uh Brazil Tunisia so my whole life was traveling
8:27 moving every three to four years it was kind of a conversation where are we going next what's happening next different schools different languages so that kind of I think led to my dream of traveling experiencing different cultures always being in like the five senses different smells different foods you know the more variety the better and uh so that kind of leads me to you know where I am today which will'll move in the story but that's the that's the foundation that's the past I thought about being a a flight attendant for you know back in the day it was everybody was the captain and we flew so much I'm like well I'm gonna be a flight attendant but um yeah we kept moving around and
9:02 then I ended up coming to States of Virginia for high school college got two closed in again in the US that us culture I was like getting stifled I'm like there's more to do in the world there's more to see I can't just stay in this little Virginia town and ended up joining the Peace Corp in Africa again wow so put anywhere in the world I checked that box anywhere in the world ended up in the Sahel desert of Niger West Africa uh working on a women's Community Development initiative project they realized they were mainly focusing on men the Peace Corps for years and left the women out and men were spending most of the money in indigenous countries on prostitution and liquor
9:37 that's what they found out over time I'm not gonna you know blanket it's all but that was a statistic so they brought women in to work with women and the village had to build a mud hut for me that was their Village contribution because they didn't have actual money of course to pass around but that's how they could show we want a volunteer here we want this woman to come and work with women so yeah I mean when I called home or wrote a letter mom I want to do this and that like she knew she created someone who's just going to be Forward Thinking to going off not holding back of what if what if am I gonna get hurt what's gonna happen it's just she jumped in and did that with her life so of course Legacy that's what happened to me
10:12 right and that's that's where I ended up meeting my husband I met um my Marine in the middle of Africa who would have thought I wasn't looking and he was the marine security guard uh guarding Duty for the US Embassy so I understood the embassy culture I'm like oh I live that in my youth State Department I get it I never really knew much about the Marines very vaguely I think I remember going to a marine house in Brazil or maybe Tunisia to go watch a movie they always had like movie nights so that's all I kind of Remembered in my like oh so now this is the guy that runs this whole thing so met him as a he wasn't a deck Commander then he was a marine security
10:47 guard and worked his way up over the years but um that was how we started and that's the the traveling and marrying into the military was kind of like marrying back into the state department a little different Liv style and a little more you know PTSD and War and deployment a little different emotional intelligence to deal with but um but that's where it all started and when I moved around every two three years four years it was normal for me like okay well it turned into every like two years it was used to be four or five with the state department then it goes to like one and a half to two with the military maybe three one place I mean it's your your life is it's
11:23 it's it's really like a movie I mean excuse me some of the things you said I had flashes of certain movies like when you said you know you lived in Cameroon right and it reminds me of that that that scene in trading places with um with um I went up on his name all of a sudden Eddie Murphy and d right they're on the train and he's like I'm from Cameroon you thing and and of course everybody's looking at him like oh yeah this is a typical right and it's it's so he he plays he he he twists The Stereotype so brilliantly in that movie
11:59 movie right this is what people think goes on there Eddie you said Eddie Murphy Eddie Murphy it was isn't it he was also in Coming to America that's the whole right that's right coming to yeah I love all those those movies yeah and then somebody's like well you were in the peace cor you got to watch that peace cor movie I think it was with Tom Hanks so I had to pay like $3 doll on YouTube or something I could not find it anywhere for free but I'm like I'm downloading this and it was just hilarious retract of some peace core things that come up and the other thing that strikes me is you're father was was was sort of a real life Sydney portier yes oh that's a beautiful
12:35 analogy of him he looked that way too he dressed I mean I just I I I love Sydney poier he is just the most amazing actor I've read two of his biographies um you know how he started out this this you know he was a poor boy living in you know Jamaica and and he he built his life and and and and you know and in his movies he's he's that sort of forward thinking but with with such amazing dignity right that's that's what just always strikes me about um um uh Sydney porer and also just an amazing
13:12 gratitude and and so he's I think he's such a powerful um individual and and your dad strikes me like I said as being a real life version of the you know the movie roles that that potier played so oh I love how you compare it to that and he was was a presence he was a life force when he walked in a room people noticed him and he had this magical smile you know really dark skin but then this white white smile he took really good care of his teeth and they were shiny and white and he always he always was very proud like I I don't think he had one cavity and he died at 56 I'm sure they weren't
13:47 coming around the corner but um he P he did that this smile and so I think I have my dad's smile too carried that on and it just made people comfortable feel welcome wherever we moved every country we lived in he was the life of the party you know on the weekends everybody knew Bill Gray like you just knew he was there and then you add my mom to his arm with her beautiful in the 80s or whatever with her beehive or the 70s in running around her blonde beehive up I mean they were just quite a couple when they were in Vienna Austria they actually pulled my dad on the side on a into a modeling thing on stage for like
14:22 you know very Vienna Vienna Austria suits I don't even know the tailor made stuff but they wanted him on stage modeling suit so on the weekends on fun he was I have video or pictures of him in photo album and he's dressed to the tea in these suits modeling on a Runway with all these beautiful European women on his arms my mom sitting in the audience like is this a good idea and um he was modeling the catwalk up and down and I did little modeling in my past too he he thought it would be good for you know public speaking for presentation I ended up becoming runner up Miss Teen Washington in DC in high school so I would was going to a few
14:58 pageants and dipped into that a little bit but you know it wasn't my world it was more just for the scholarships for school and just for that stage presence you know so but you may you may not be comfortable answering this and if so just say hey I decline to answer but but I I I feel compelled to to to ask you this question from what you've described about your parents they were such strong presences not just in your life but in the world and for so many children I think somehow that cowls them in a way where
15:34 they feel they can never live up to this image that their parents present and that's clearly not the case with you so did you ever sense that that was an issue or or how how did you deal with having these sort of almost Larger than Life parents right how how how you deal with that I just love these questions so I guess I mean I've been saying biracial but I really could say tri-racial for years I always grown up like in a Melting Pot so I didn't really see color
16:09 I was raised to see character so you know everything based on color and all that like it was foreign and crazy to me like you you stand up for your character and that's who if you're hiring some for a job like what qualification they have what kind of integrity and character do they have so everything I did was around the character of a person you know and if they had kind of a shady character that maybe you know the sum of five were not leading me in the right sum of Direction getting me more into trouble then Veer away from that character but it wasn't a color thing or anything it was it was character what are how are you showing up every day how are you in alignment with your goals and the things you're doing and you know you want to
16:44 put yourself around people that are doing similar and and pushing you forward and people that are maybe two steps ahead of you to reach that so so character was a huge part of it um for for me so being biracial the character how and my parents I mean I I just feel like they always said like you can be whatever you want to be they never kind of set limitations on me like whatever your dreams and your goals you know go for it you know and when I call home with I want to do this I want to work at Department of Justice and be an intern don't go for that in DC take the metro and go down there and you know apply and sign up like I don't I didn't hear many NOS when it came to things I wanted to
17:19 to dabble in it was like and I want to go this and and uh for college I ended up at the College of VO M Mary it was a very small school I could not do well in large crowds because the state department Community is kind of small and intimate and when I was in schools overseas they were always like maybe six to 10 kids in a classroom so when I did my whole school rotation for college and drove all over Virginia I mean I assumed I was going to be in state to get the tuition now kids like I don't care I'm going to Alaska or wherever back then I was like well this is where we live this is where I'm looking for a school I didn't think to go spend money anywhere else and uh when I got to the larger
17:55 schools I felt like lost it was too many people it was too much commotion and I I couldn't I just wasn't equipped for that as much it would have been harder you know to struggle I could have gotten through with it but once I stepped on that campus at wayi and Mary and I saw it was like um maybe 6,000 students total the the classroom teacher student ratio was smaller and it just had that whole Colonial quaint town uh with cobblestone streets that's the school that's adjacent to Colonial Williamsburg right yes wave Mary is Colonial Williamsburg so we're like a tourist Capital with Bush Gardens down the road and people going to Duke of
18:30 glester street we called it dog Street and you I mean on your way to class at least a few times a week a tourist will you know walk up and say excuse me which way is dog Street you know they're lost somewhere on our campus and they're trying to get across the street for bread ends and fudge and all the stuff and they have reenactments and Guillotines and people dressed I mean fabulous place I encourage everybody to go driveth through Williamsburg and it's grown now when I was there there were three pubs so you couldn't get in trouble like there was no internet we we had one Library actually used it we went and pulled out The Dewy Decimal System with the roll deck stuff and now I go back and there's like wine tastings and
19:06 little you know fruit ble little like wine and d and I'm like okay but that's what happens college campuses they explode yeah ended up at a really small school because I felt comfortable there I felt like I could be seen and heard and if I raise my hand someone can answer me straight away I don't need to like you know make an office appointment three weeks out to counselor whatever so that's where I ended up but that forward thinking and then uh my mom study at um what did you study at William and Mary so I studied international relations oh okay yeah because you know I was kind of running the international life at at that point I went and Undeclared but it
19:42 seemed like all the classes I kept taking were international law international politics everything went into this International vein so by junior year when they're like okay you got to declare major now I'm like okay well let's sit down and see what it looks like and they're like you're in the IR track that's international relations and then they had like 10 or 12 different branches Middle East studies you know southeast Asia all these different countries basically and then the one that I gravitated to was development was my sub Niche because it was focusing on developing countries and helping them you know live and and create create environments that are
20:17 subsistence and be able to work on their own and create their own subsistence economies so development I mean from the the countries I lived in a lot of my life they were Second World countries third world so development just kind of felt like a natural fit for me and um I took so many I was I'm I'm a Christian I took a lot of uh uh religion philosophy classes and they're like hey you know if you take a few more classes you could be a philosophy double major I'm like well I don't know what I'm gonna do with that but why not graduate with two majors instead of one if it could fit on there a lot of philosophy classes on the side
20:52 like existentialism you know does this pen really exist and those teachers I just like to show up at the class because the teachers were so out ponytails and Birkenstocks and I'm like who are these people but it was fun so we did that and I graduated yeah with the IR and my mom at the same time had a friend she met in Brazil in the 70s and like me my mom keeps her friendships and connections from the past pre- internet and all that so then you gotta keep that going with snail mail you know and letters right but one of her friends probably was a pivotal Point Millie I can put a plugin for Millie and she said to me you know
21:28 she had done um the Peace Corp years ago and was a DOD teacher later in Germany went back to with um a Department of Defense to teach English as a second language or something so she had at some point had a phone call conversation with me and said you know if you're thinking about the Peace Corp you know this might be good fit for you it's a development C developing world that's your degree um but she said I I advise you to apply maybe one year in advance because it's pretty competitive so you should start thinking about it like your junior year and doing the application process and I thought I thought that's some people just get out of school and you know join and I didn't even think you need a college degree but they're so selective
22:03 now you actually need a degree wow so uh you need yeah they have to streamline it more so if without a college degree they're not even looking at your application so I took her advice and I applied you know a year before and it also depends where you're applying I tell people I was kind of in Virginia DC Hub big International Hub a lot more competition once I got to the Peace Corp you know I ran into Backpackers that were like oh I was just passing through Utah and I signed up you know right there on the spot and I'm like what it took me a year to get my paperwork in and it also depends on your background like if you had nursing background or construction they could put you in a box
22:38 real you know a little quicker in Africa or wherever and I was international relations and philosophy and they'd call me be like which we're trying to figure out where to put you you know your degree is a little more I'm like well I want to go and I speak French fluently so yeah that's how I ended up in in Africa but had my mom's friend not had a conversation with me maybe I would have not considered it and I would have applied too late I was actually it took almost a year I mean they would call me at school to test if I spoke French and I was speaking French better than the recruiter on the other end I'm like would you like to go in German now my mom's German we can speak German too they're like we just need to verify what you put on your application right so we
23:13 took care of that and then it was a waiting game uh and I was actually had signed up to go do a masters in public administration MPA Masters in public administration at the University of Delaware that was my backup plan the peace was going to contact and literally the weekend I was going to go i' had gotten accepted and I was going to go look for housing and start that path the Peace Corp called and said you know congratulations you've made into the Peace Corp and you're heading to Chicago for your medical screening and then on so they gave us a bunch of shots in the butt and wherever like just poking us we were go we were government material by
23:48 then yeah that's how I ended up back in the Peace Corp wow so and and you said you were in the Sahel um in in Niger which is interesting because that's quite a um that that that area has been in the news of late with all the turmoil there yes what was it like being there you were there in was it the 80s or 90s the 90s 93 to 96 about yeah I yeah when as soon as I left college and what was it like being there you know in the sort of early to mid 90s yeah I would say
24:24 back then you know not quite the wild wild west but definitely not as developed as now maybe and things were just more off radar I was there I was the last group to do Peace Corp before the internet came out before everybody got an email account before that whole technology age boost so we were still kind of you know now you look back it was like peaceful you just live in the moment you live in the now I mean I did mail to get a note to to my nearest uh peace volunteer was by camel someone from my Village was passing my Hut and I'm like oh there's a volunteer going to the market day like that was a place to interact and socialized the women got
24:59 there to work on their income their activities and their basket weaving and peanut oil sale and whatever so that's a big you know Hub the the market week Market time so your your mail went back and forth by letter you know with the guy on the camel like can you pass that to the lady at the flower station and then my peace cor friend Michelle would go there and pick it up and that's how we'd communicate when we'd get together or just share thoughts whatever so it was it was a different world different time uh when I joined you could either get like a a donkey a horse or a motorcycle I mean you had like three
25:34 modes of transportation from your village and I picked the motorcycle which was you know kind of hard to get used to in the Sahel desert I had black and blue bruises all over me from falling left and right but my now husband Marine Corps uh boyfriend at that time he taught me he's the one that taught me how to ride a motorcycle in the sand I went to the Peace Corps training but that was on hard packed dirt and gravel in the city and I lived three days away closer to the Chad Border in soft sand they didn't take that into consideration when they trained me to ride the motorcycle wow so but yeah so the time there uh it was nostalgic in your 20s too I don't know
26:10 how you were in your 20s but you feel like you're Invincible you don't think about dying you don't think about the next turn and who can maybe hurt you right you just you just jump in all in so I was just you know showing up and I I guess I had enough confidence that I gravitated that energy of you know strength around me so I didn't attract negativity and I mean rape did happen certain things did happen but not in not in my world and um yeah it was it was crazy everything by Transportation was local you know bus with horses and camels and goats stuff hanging off of it it was just a different time the cars
26:45 were held together with bungee cords and tomato paste cans I remember like when something didn't work you just pull over the side of the road and they're literally rubber banding the car together and again my mother amazing she's been with us all over wherever we've moved with the military she helps me with the kids when my husband was deployed but she even came to my little African village she said I want to go see my daughter while she's in afca like what mother does this like yeah looking back again she was just like well that's where she is and I want to go see where she lives and how she lives and we had met at first in a Europe in Germany by her family for Christmas and she could
27:21 sense I was very like aggressive and defensive with stuff and she didn't know where that was coming from and once she got to Africa realized that was survival mechanism I had to I had to like just be a little more short a little more put that Vibe don't mess with me because that's like the world I was living to protect myself in I guess so once she got there she's like okay I understand now why my daughter has to be a little more aggressive on ited and she made it from the city where most people stop anywhere they stop at the city they go to the resort and that's the end of it right but no she took those local Bush taxis we call them Transportation with
27:57 me all the way to my Village my brother had come to it was a little more of a shock for him and she just got integrated with the the people she met my Village mom CU I said there was a woman in the village that always left brought me food or when I travel and I came back she always had a bowl of food at the door and it was Millet with sorghum okra it was like Snot nothing fancy but this was what they lived on so that's what I got learned to eat you know my I chipped a tooth once biting into rice because there was a rock there you know so I had to go to a French dentist for my a tooth repair that was a little scary but um my mom came and I'll never forget the moment when I brought
28:33 my mom to my Village mom and said this is marama this is the woman who takes care of me when I'm here and my mom I'm sure has been praying for me every day like protect my daughter in this Village I had 500 people they only spoke Barry Barry canori only a village of 500 people which was again a good setting for me because I like small environments and I just remember my mom and this Village mom holding hands and hugging and just crying and connecting like two mothers were connecting my real mom she got to meet my real mom who gave me birth and then my Village mom who's was taking care of me wow so yeah there's my mom again like what mother jumps in and
29:09 says come join and then when in the city the boyfriend which is now the husband you know could shuttle her around in the rink cor van and deliver fresh baguette to where she was staying he found them a place to stay when they were in the city so you know he was already uh setting a good impression for her at that point like who because my mother would even tell me oh my gosh at some point I sent her a postcard fell in love with a marine moving to Rome that's kind of how after we separated yeah look your eyes lit up that's I'm sure what my mom did plus worse in the US like literally she thought she's getting her baby back and I'm gonna go on to school or do something and the postor just said fell
29:45 in love with the Marine moving to Rome because that's where his next assignment was Rome Italy and um so yeah she she had to do with that but that's what she created I always say this is all part of you you know like I can't think any different l so yeah wow so now so now you were you got married and and you moved with with your your husband to Rome and he he was he was at the embassy there or at the embassy and I do have to say too yeah my mom would always oh gosh she had me questioning too she would say do you really love the man or do you just love the house he lives in and the
30:21 food that he's providing because you'd go to the Marine house and you'd have hot dogs and hamburgers and popcorn and that sure was a nice changed from my Millet and okra sorghum from the village you know and then the house was this beautiful Lush castle that six Marines lived in they had a housekeeper and they had a pool to swim in and she was just like constantly like just make sure it's the right guy because there's a lot of you know exterior factors you could be looking at then you you know down the road you look at the guy and be like who is this guy I I really just just like the hamburger in the house but again she forgot that she in gred character me I found someone with Incredible character
30:56 and when I saw how he you know presented himself and the things he did in the community and how he worked with the embassy and on his time off and where he spent his time the character Echelon which is building and building and building I'm like nope it's not the food it's not the hot dogs it's not the house so yeah so end up in Italy and um he was already pre-planning before I came I went to the Marine Corps ball there once flew there and back and then I extended in Africa and almost lost him because you know I we had a call a phone call and these phone calls were on the rotary phone thing it was a like a dollar AE minute I watched the counter go and I would spend my entire I made $200 a
31:32 month Kevin $200 a month at the peace C Vol people like how do you do that well it's fine when you live in a mud hut and you're eating you know Millet and sorum but when you join the rest of the world you're not getting far so when I would do these phone calls and we would have to write let her write three day three months ahead like schedule like go this I'm gonna go to this point this day this time to be by this phone number for our phone call you know he was just at the embassy somewhere but I had to really make do some movement that took time and I'd get there and watch the counter go and I would use my $200 bill my my $200 payment what I made my bread and butter for for living on
32:08 for the month and I'd watch we'd hang up and I'm like I'm out of money honey we got I love you I got to go and I'm just sitting there like wow I just used every penny of my my paycheck for this phone call for love for this phone call for this guy so and then we had one intense call when I told him that I was extending in the Peace Corp because I was applying and got accepted for a volunteer leader position so I moved out of my Village my after two years into this the city the nearest city was still two hours away from my Village still close to Chad it was called zind there and um I lived there in a house and I
32:44 was in charge of 30 to 40 volunteers that were all in the area so I was the one that went out and helped them get settled helped them with their Grant projects for whatever you know they're doing in their Villages and yeah it was a position that I said I wanted to do this I got accepted and I didn't want to pass it up and I felt in my heart that it was probably the last thing I was going to be doing on my own on my own time because after that it was gonna be connected to someone else right so yeah that was a hard phone call and he was just like why am I waiting for you what are you do what are you doing you're extending in Africa really like why am I waiting for you and I'm like I still
33:19 love you honey I just I gotta do this one last thing and I told the Peace Corp director it was a one-year assignment and I went into his office and said you know my heart is in Rome already that's where my the love of my life is but I really want this job I know I can do a great job and I'm here for six months you can have me for six months not one year I'll stay for six months and I will get so much produced for you and keep everybody at peace and you know really take care of our volunteers or I'm on the plane tomorrow I can't stay a year but you can have me for six months thank God it was like one of my first negotiations I did and it worked he said
33:54 we'll take you for six months like he knew I'd probably do a year wor in six months so we had to do with a military coup I mean I had a radio out there and at one point the government went crazy so speaking about volatility you never know what happens when you're in these countries and I literally had the walkie-talkie with him saying round up the volunteers and go to the you know hibernating spot on the border of Nigeria wow and I had to round up everybody and anybody with cars whatever I had to pick people up we had Movement we went literally to some tent camping house at the border and had to sit there for days and wait for an answer of Are We Crossing into Nigeria and like
34:30 evacuating or are we going back to our Villages and you would see trucks going by with AK-47s and guys with flipflops AK-47s gasoline strikes cars lined up everywhere there was no gasoline at the gas pumps kind of craziness I mean when I look back at this sometimes I'm like I lived all that but back then in my 20s was like oh well just another day at work all right round them up let's get to the Border fast forward now in this in in my age oh my gosh they did have a few older volunteers and they became like the mother hens there was um one lady she was always baking anytime we got together for an event she was like
35:06 the one baking and then there was a couple that came from um some farmland and they were doing animal husbandry so there were some couples that you know or ladies that got divorced and were starting life over or a couple that just sold everything in the US and joined the peace course so there were a couple eot but mostly in in nier was people right out of college just it was a harsh climate harsh temperature all that stuff but yeah so we uh that's that's what happened I ended up in in Italy and he found me a pension he found a military oh no was an Italian woman who used to be married to a military person and um somebody in the military and he had
35:42 passed away and she was a widow so she had a room that she would rent in her little pension home just up the road of via Veno which if you don't know is the main strip of Rome where the embassy is via Veno these name just come back and uh so he communicated with her and said hey can you know my girlfriend live here because the Marines I mean they had rules they had schedules they had curfews it was great dating for you know it's like you might as well parents should be really happy when you're dating in the military you can't go back to their room they need to check in at 5: am be sharp and dressed and ready to go so it was a good dating routine but
36:18 uh so we uh I had the apartment there that I rented I think it was like a100 or $200 a month I paid her and as soon as I got there I went to apply you know the only job at the em I could do was at the commissary I'm like whatever so I noticed I tried to of course work like in the political attache office and media I was trying to do all this other stuff but everybody that had uh parents working there who got the summer jobs when they came it was their kids that were all for the summer so all these kids were bilingual they were our age and they were speaking uh uh Italian and you know just running the place I'm like gosh look at these kids so for me all
36:53 that was left was um the commissary but I don't care it was a job it could pay my bill and I and my husband or my boyfriend was standing guard right above me I mean I was in heaven and so I ended up working I was the the the stalker not like stalking on social media but the food stalker and I I know like I was the stalker I gotta clarify so the food stalker I literally was the one that was putting the cans on the shelves and lining up the price tags and I was the happiest employee ever they would just walk around they're like what is wrong with this girl well I was in air conditioned environment after living in
37:28 100 something degrees sweating for two and a half years I forgot what AC was and you know normal temperatures I was a I had access to American food that I hadn't for three years I mean every shelf was like a candy store in heaven I'm like my God the ice cream they had it everything get shipped over in pallets American Products uhuh so between the AC uh the American products and my the love of my love you know 10 20 feet above the other floor right yeah walked around with a pretty big smile on my face and people were like what what's her story what is that and then they
38:03 figured out where it came from and all that and so pretty quickly within a month or two they decided to train me to be cashier now this is funny this is mindset stuff again I was so happy in my little box just doing my labels and getting the pallets that would come down the shoot off the back nobody you know really talks you sees you I'm just doing my thing in my world and I'd get off duty and I'd have my free time with my husband we're going husband my boyfriend and we're eating p p on you know and the patas and throwing coins in the Trevy Fountain like life couldn't get any better and they're like no no no we have one of our cashiers is leaving she's moving back to the States we need to fill the position you need to be a
38:39 cashier and I'm talking myself out of a job and a promotion I'm like no I think I just want to stay right here with you know the the shelves and the stocking it's too much for me and they're like please M we're going to train you you can do this and I said do we have to like handle conversion money too like L and dollars at the checkout cuz this is getting we but I was not the math major like my dad accounting and they're like yeah some people will pay with dollars and some will pay with lra and I'm like I'm out I can't do this and they're like get up front you're gonna sit by Susie Q or whatever her name was so I sat by her
39:14 and shadowed her for days and just okay all right and then she put me in the seat a little okay and then yeah before you knew it I moved up to like head cashier and it was so fun and I didn't realize again being in the commissary is kind of like centcom for the embassy everybody goes through there to get their favorite products everybody gets to know your name like Vanessa the cashier at the commissary in the basement it and add for the people listening a commissary is like a grocery store yes yes a grocery store another military acary grocery store but you can only get into onto the you know Embassy if you've
39:50 got proper identification it's for very like it's for the employees for the staff that work there so yeah working at the commissary and then um after that yeah I would get off duty and just we would Tour all but when you're centcom and people are coming through you to buy things that's where I think I had three months of rentree in Italy Kevin I'll never forget this someone was coming through and they all do home leave I remember that when I was on the other side with the state department once a month for the year you go back home to your family you go ex extended family you get out of your whatever country you're living in and so people had pets
40:26 and Plants and Things that needed to be tended to so there's Vanessa checking out your ice cream and your bread and whatever and they're like oh would you mind watching our dog for a month because we have a home Leaf coming up absolutely what's your address I didn't even discuss money it was a free place to stay sure so after the pensia thing 100 or 200 a month wasn't much but I said okay I I'll start house sitting for free so saved some money there I did dog wa uh dog watching I watched cats and I'm kind of allergic to cats like we got two Himalayan cats I'm like that's okay I'll take it and it was an apartment complex told my husband you're my
41:01 boyfriend I keep I already I already pushed him to husband yeah I told him you're cleaning the litters because I got some allergies and stuff like this is going to be hard okay no problem so I stayed in the most beautiful homes in different places one gave me a car access and said you know use it in case of emergency well they were having like strikes and stuff all the time with the bus system and stuff there was always something going on so I had to drive I got to drive the car to work at the embassy and they were confused with the you're not matching the ID on here I'm like well call them up in the US or whatever I'm staying at their place open the gate I work here and then you know I yeah so we took that car and then the one time I had to move it off of the
41:37 compound I won't forget either I got a note on the car saying we're raring or something all cars to the street I'm like H okay so I it's an emergency I can't keep the car here well they were just about to come back from their trip and somebody had swiped the side of their car the one time it was at the street so now it looks like I'm some you know driving thing around the patas in tiny streets going into fountains with it I'm like literally the one time I moved it to the side of the street it got swiped of course no note no etiquette like that but they came back and I'm like we had to move it I think there were cameras outside too I said we had to move the cars they T they were like don't worry about it and I remember
42:12 the Marine cor ball came up I didn't even ask for payment yet I was just happy to have a free place I was just happy with the free place but they still gave me a nice thick envelope with all these $100 bills for watching their Dawn one place had me watching cats or um plants this was funny it was a rooftop uh what do they call those pen houses so they had access to the roof and had plants all over the place now I don't have a green thumb my my husband or my boyfriend did and uh I'm like okay I'll watch your plants and so immediately I'm back to him like you're gonna have to help me with the plants I know it's not cats now but I need help we got to keep
42:47 these plants alive while I'm stay so I and then it rained most of that month of August so they were getting watered by Nature anyway so it was a great time when I got her free place and then the guy that was running the cashier or the commissary ended up getting engaged and moved in with his girlfriend and he had like a sub for six or eight months still available so I ended up there in his beautiful place in trest Deere which is like an art district where you hear you open up your back doors and you hear old Italian women singing while they're making pasta you hear the pots clanking and they're singing papar playing out of Windows and you're like is this me so
43:25 yeah so that's where this book also came out of you know the whole I love me and then I love you is my a story about my husband so it's our kind of our Lawrence in Arabia because you started off even saying like this sounds like a movie and people are always telling me like where's your book and I'm like you know what I'm tired of ask answering that question like I don't know one day so this year it's it's a bunch of different authors but you can see pictures actually there's my picture look at that's the nomads those are the Tes of agadez and there I am yeah in my little mud hut so you can read about that there's a QR code so you can hear me talking about it
44:00 um but yeah I ended up there and there was the the order actually did not come marriage and then baby so I have to always do a disclaimer there too and this is part of me letting go of all that religious um builtup pent up you know a shame because I was a baby coming before the marriage so I say navigated a military lifestyle from Birkenstocks it was the Birkenstocks first in the Peace Corp I should have added braided hair for another bee my hair was always like in these braids just so I didn't have to deal with the curl and the nap and then babies came and then backend Battlefield so instead of the front end Battlefield
44:36 that the military veteran the military active duty are doing I'm in the back end the spouses and the families we're in the back end but it's still a battlefield we're trying to manage our kids schooling figuring out where we're moving next mail bills that's a backend Battlefield y you know and now we're in a boondocking in Blissful retirement so that's kind of the whole trajectory but the baby did kind of kind of K you know we were in Italy what can I tell you I don't know disclaimer and next thing my mom came to the I said Mom I'm pregnant she flew back to Italy she did the Marine Corps ball with me and I was out to here we came back I went back with my mom and
45:12 then he couldn't get married you can't get married on the active on The Military Marine security guard program they actually have to sign a waiver they the government oh they can't be dealing with girlfriends and wives because this is what happen then there's babies and now are we going to put up the wife and the kid so they literally have to sign something that that's not happening but as soon as I'm like what date are you out when does that when does that commitment end and it ended in December which is why we were married on December 4th and literally he got off the plane we went to Fairfax County Courthouse got that that Court certification thing so we still I still talk about I'm like I still need my church wedding I never
45:47 quite got that in or reule the vows you can do it you're a chaplain so um yeah so then we ended up going through and I remember standing in the line at the courthouse too you know not a very sexy fun white bride day you know I'm like okay I'm going I have a Hospital appointment next week to deliver this baby and I'm standing in this line and the guy behind the counter would be like marriage or divorce divorce right marriage I'll never forget and I'm standing in this line and everybody divorce right divorce right and I'm like and he gets marriage or divorce I'm like
46:23 marriage left you I was the only one that went the other way and I have to find this woman but clar Melita little Spanish lady I still remember her name but she's the one that officiated our our vows carita and I remember calling messaging my mom or calling her from a Hardline phone probably didn't even have a cell phone then and uh said hey Mom I'm getting married at the courthouse you know it's kind of near your office do you want to come join horrible horrible please children don't do this to your parents and she had to go to her boss and say so do you think I could take an EXT Ed lunch my daughter's getting married at
46:58 the courthouse down the road I mean things we do to our parents and the guy said by all means take off the whole rest of the afternoon you know and she said she was driving her car through red lights she was just you know completely in a blur driving over curves and bumps but she made it there so we only have a few pictures from the the wedding day and they're my mom holding the camera so most of it's blurry because she's just I'm like and mom take the picture and she's like what is going on and then we'd go out and say we're g to go look for a stroller and we'd come back with a car one day you know I like well we need a stroller before a car we
47:33 got to get this stuff get it all together we thank God military we got things going but she was like they went out for a stroller and came back with a car it was a used car we've so it just keeps going so so you you not only your husband not only got out of the military but you immediately there you immediately got married and had a baby all within a short period of time we didn't get out of the military we went right I'm sorry I left that part out so right from the courthouse and our marriage certificate we went right to quanico Virginia Marine Corp base and
48:09 got my military ID oh so he just got off of he just got off of Embassy Duty Embassy Duty where he couldn't get married gotcha oh wow wow okay yes and we even got I remember in Italy we got to find out his his Deb Commander he the Detachment Commander called now he's he was the detach commander and then my husband came all the way up to different levels to overseeing the Detachment Commander so going back over time we've we've done all the different levels of marine security guard but in Italy I remember top was called the Detachment Commander called top I don't know what the acronym was again but he called us in his office and you know he's like
48:44 listen everybody knows you came here from Africa like the word you know stuff spread like wildfire in those old communities so you're not supposed to be here you definitely can't be living with him like what's your plan you know like please stay under the radar this is not not normal you know and I think he just thought we were like a little fling and you know it'd be over and he's like I don't want any bounce checks I don't want any problems in town and I said you know excuse me sir like you've got 20s something Marines here don't don't you think the one that's got like the steady girlfriend like he's the one you can go to sleep with that night he's the one you can relax for it's the other 19 that are running around loose on the street
49:19 on their time off this is a good thing actually so that's until the baby came but um so yeah he he had his little conversation with us and you know said he ex he's doing exception expecting you know us to be right on the same page with him and I always wanted to send him a card or a letter back like you know we've been married 27 plus years now and I want to send him a letter like hi top you know we're still together you know because I think he wondered like oh these guys with these girlfriends they come and go here you know but there we were so yeah so we were still active duty we went back to my mom's house and
49:54 she had still all this baggage from my dad when he pass like full Furniture full dining room her China wear was just eating up space in her basement she was ready to pass it on to whichever kid got married first my brother or me and it happened to be me I'm on a timeline now so basically yeah the courthouse to the Marine Corps Base this the ID uh the Bethesda naval Medical Hospital which is kind where the presidents go right so born in camon Africa and my children get to go to the Bethesda naval hospital and so had our daughter there stayed up home with my mom and while my husband was
50:29 transitioning out of marine security guard and getting his next assignment he showed up the house with a rider truck and we packed up everything my mom had and and gave her hugs and kisses and took off to Camp P to Marine Corps Base clear across the country that was his you came out here wow yeah so that was the first and the last we started there 20 something years ago and somehow did a whole world tour and ended up at Camp Bon as well but yeah and I thought the military would move us because in the state department side the movers come to your house and pack your stuff up and then ship your cart all but my husband he's so good he's the accountant too I didn't realize I was Marrying an
51:04 accountant my dad was an account it's all coming together over time right so I'm like okay I see so he's always thinking of you know how to maximize or benefits this and that when we're not home we run an Airbnb we're always doing something so yeah he said what he said we're doing a diddy move another do it yourself yes I'm like what is that where are the people he's like no where're the people we get the check and we back it ourselves and I'm like I'm just had a baby I'm supposed to back China you know trying to have a pity party so quickly learn you can't say no can't say can't all that so right I'm like but we don't even have find it be
51:40 creative I'm using underwear t-shirts I'm bubbling up my mom's China wear we got it we got that van packed up and off we rod with that baby in the car seat and the middle between us bouncing with our acid reflux we made it as far as Georgia to his family he said yeah you guys are staying I'm driving out I'll fly you over when I find us a place so that was it it took a year to move on the base California Camp peneton had limited housing at the time there was a weit list I'm like what we move on a base but we don't move on a base like what is this like yeah it's a one-year weight list you know gotta go into town so we ended up in San Clemente for a year in a little Triplex they called it
52:16 didn't know what that was either for a while but you know three units together zero Triplex I learned I learned about what was it zero lot a zero lot size or something I'm like what zero lot line it's all California stuff right you're many that was where the Western White House was at one time when when yes yeah and I was we were living one street away from delmare that beautiful downtown on a Avenue to Granada I didn't even know because what by the time we got there all we were doing was unpacking boxes I'm breastfeeding a baby I'm like what just happened to my life you know and uh you
52:52 know when I came out to breathe the fresh air and I literally walked out with the baby in a stroller he's off to work and I ask excuse me which way to the beach I'll never forget you know the people are on delmare they're like just down the hill and I did like you know two blocks down the hill with a stroller and I saw the Pacific Ocean with the San clementy pier and I'm like wow we're pretty close to the ocean I had no idea so that here became our like go-to meal when we didn't want to cook it they had2 doll plates every night was you know either rib KN or chicken KN for $2 dollar I'm like I
53:27 don't feel like cooking tonight so we would go and it would got our walk in walked all the way down the pier and then it was always the negotiating who was pushing the stroller uphill because when you if you've been to S clementy going up that hill from the pier up it's you're huffing and puffing and we were like in our 20s and then with the stroller so yeah I pushed the stroller up for some exercise ended up teaching jazzer size there because I'd be in the back the first week or two and the teacher's like you and I'd start moving up front necking you you're gonna be my sub I'm like what I don't do yes so I did a quick little CPR thing and I'm her sub for jazzer size which was fun my
54:02 husband was gone I was like he's like you got to find ways to keep fit I'm like well I can work out and they always had jazzer size always has the child care next door so you roll your baby and your stroller right there and you get your little chit ticket thing and you get on the stage I'm like perfect for those mom I ended up going to work at on delmare at uh P bonome it was called I just loved the name because it was French so it was a little baby store and I'd walk in there PE bonome well as soon as I walked in I find out the woman has this French accent she's Belgian we start speaking French and she's like would you like to work here I need some help okay I live a block away so I'm walking to work with the stroller going
54:38 to do my Jazzercise with the stroller and she had a little play area she's like yeah you bring your daughter I've got veggie tailes and little tape she can play here it's all set up so I got to yeah but that's how it is wherever I went I was always looking for how can I make a little supplemental income how can I get out of the house and be a part of a community MH you know what can I do with with my role as a military spouse and it's very colorful and crazy but that's it everywhere we moved I ended up working either for the embassy uh Regional security officer assistant I've worked um for American Business group in Abu Dhabi like helping Network groups together I've worked for a local Emira
55:15 Shake company that was doing training they were flying over uh pilots and doctors and all kinds of people in that industry of of health and uh wellness and they'd fly them over and put them up festar Hotel so I had to make sure the belly dancers were there at night and I was running events I didn't want to leave when we were in Abu Dhabi and I told my husband like oh your next assignment is Hawaii I think I'll stay here with the kids I am all set now I've got my routine I've got I've got this great job and he's like no no it doesn't work that way I don't leave my family in the Middle East without all of his benefits because now I'd be like on the local market right so wherever we go I
55:50 ended up being like um what was it a women's English-speaking women's Association never go to the restroom during an election you might come back and they'll votee you into something so I went to the restroom English speaking women's Association we were living in conic guia I came back and they're like okay we just voted you in as president I'm like no I'm not even applying they're like yeah you're you're the face you're the yeah we'll we'll help you we're gonna do everything with you but we needed someone's leaving and we need to fill it and it's you I'm like I just went to the bathroom so we had the best time we ran all kinds of charitable events like we did Galas and all this stuff and all the money went into local orphanages and local community stuff so
56:26 did pick the right person and I ran with it and had fun I work for Centers for Disease Control in Trinidad and Tobago doing AIDS initiatives like my my resume is just crazy but on that other side it's hard when you're in the US and just trying to Claw at a job or whatever they look at your resume and they're like you've been all over the place and how long are you staying like I didn't realize people don't hire military spouses a lot in the US because they're like oh they're only going to be here for two years we don't want to invest all that time and energy and training and then they're gone right that's a whole other thing too so but overseas it works out well because you're already there with your spouse people get to
57:02 know you positions are open and you can move around but yeah we've done you've gone on a whirlwind tour with me and how many minutes do we well so unfortunately we're we're out of time we're gonna have to do a part two of this hopefully you you will you know you'll you'll come back because I think we're only partway through your milit your time in the military with your husband and and there's the whole you know transitioning from military to civilian so um but but like I said unfortunately the the hour is up it just zoomed by I mean your stories are fascinating oh than just I I
57:39 I could I could sit and listen to you for another you know five hours um but that's the problem my husband always says can you find a job where you talk all day and then you come home and you f up all your words and I have I've been project planner man I come home and I'm still like he's like you haven't used your words up yet so I'm like I found a way honey I'm in Zoom land now I can talk all day to people don't worry but I I so just you know sort of summing things up I just wanted to pick out a couple of key things and and and and please tell me if I've I've I've got this right so you talked early on about how really character is the
58:18 central aspect of of how you view life how you view your success that that when all is said and done building your own character and and assessing the characters of the people with whom you you want to be involved that really is is kind of the The crucial factor and I I think that's to me that's absolutely that's like a universal truth but I think the other thing is is that you just you you let sort of inspiration take you and and you were
58:56 you were Fearless about the opportunities that you seize and we talk about carpedm right um but and and I if you've probably seen on my emails I always sign my emails courage at all times right and I think that if we have that courage to embrace experiences even if they don't work out the way we had in our heads they're still incredibly enriching for our lives and and and you you strike me as being an icon of of you know taking those
59:33 opportunities where where they presented themselves making them but also you making your own opportunities but also grabbing on to others and and that that you've had just an enormously rich life yes you've subed it up beautifully yeah a rich life my mom you saw I say you know turn lemons to Lemonade people say that and the other day I I read something about squeeze squeeze your day you know squeeze the day out of it so whatever is negative whatever squeeze squeeze it out squeeze squeeze the day so what are you gonna squeeze today what am I gonna squeeze today you know if if it's if if you're
60:09 in the valley or whatever like it's life is gonna be like this but right keep hope staying positive and you know sometimes I wonder why am I a life coach and what am I doing people are like you you you bring inspiration to people you bring hope light love and I'm like well I can keep doing that I like that we're going to have to get more into those aspects um the ne next time we meet um but for now um and I'm gonna have you if you don't mind I'm gonna just wrap things up and then I'll take us offline and and we'll we'll chat for just a minute so so folks I I I I
60:45 mean wow we we talk about the way to wow shows Vanessa led us there today so I I I can't imagine you didn't enjoy hearing um the first part of her story and and and I hope too that that you will take the lessons that that Vanessa presented us you'll take them to heart um and and maybe even more importantly and and this is another lesson I think is is you know she got these lessons from her parents and so this is a gift that we can give our children even if they're not little
61:20 kids anymore we can encourage our our teenagers our adult children to really really Embrace these these opportunities that that that come our way and and to not be afraid of of of what they'll bring just because we may have to sort of let go of our sense of control somewhat so um thanking you again Vanessa for for coming on the show today a real treat for me thank you all for for joining us and uh just just real quickly um this is this wraps us up for the week but on Monday at 10:00 a.m. Pacific time is in Estates weekly on
61:57 Tuesday at 10:00 a.m. Pacific time is business lessons from the military and then a week from today again at 10: am all Pacific time we'll be back for the next episode of people making money so I wish you a wonderful rest of the day and a wonderful rest of the week and signing off as I always do Marie my my my my heart from Alabama darling you are my bell all the best folks thank you